I love panel 3. Even with Derek on-hand to veto any of the stuff she really wants to do, Dorilys can still make the prisoners THINK that “zotting” is gonna hurt. Job satisfaction where you can find it…
Actually, Derek on-hand helps her be threatening. It allows her to ramp things up with the suggestion that if Derek ever fails to restrain her, things will get really dreadful.
Now I’m thinking of that story about an official world that got destroyed (flooded) because a player intentionally got a whole bunch of decanters of endless water and threw them into the ocean.
A future campaign in that world will center on the search for a mad artificer who made items only the completely insane would use. One such item: A Recanter of Endless Water.
Come to think of it, it’s a zone of truth, and it doesn’t look like it was aimed accurately enough to prevent the interrogators from being included in the area of effect…
Unfortunately Zone of Truth does not compel creatures to answer the questions. Shutting up makes the spell utter useless, at least according to player’s manual.
So how is this supposed to work with Cunningham’s law?
Also, how exactly does a zone of truth work? Is it actually about truth or just what people think the truth is? Can you speculate? Also, can you speculate as long as you need and once you can say a thing, that thing must be true? Or is it a compulsion to tell the truth (provided you talk at all)? How much can you say that doesn’t have an associated truth value (questions, wishes, etc.)? How much can you say at all (about a specific subject) if you don’t actually know the truth/think you know the truth but don’t/don’t think you know the truth/think you don’t know the truth?
And since Cunningham’s law is involved: I assume a Zot will impart a subconscious knowledge of universal truth and you can ask anyone anything and they will be able to truthfully and substantially answer about literally everything. To keep people guessing, the knowledge of the truth will be eradicated from the mortal world within a day including all records, biological or otherwise.
In Hitchhiker’s Guide, I remember there was an incident where somebody started actually telling the whole truth, and the government reacted as if truth were a highly contagious, deadly disease.
Been a while since I read it, but as I recall, the government did the right thing. The guy who was OD’d on truth serum wound up reciting secrets of the universe so deep and fundamental that any sapient being that heard them would become incurably insane.
Naturally, one of the protagonists wound up seeking the guy out. I don’t remember for certain, but I’m guessing it was Zaphod.
According to canon rules (both 3.5e and 5e), a zone of truth means you can’t deliberately lie. You can still claim something that turns out to be incorrect, so long as you honestly believed it to be true.
Canon rules also, though, state that affected creatures know they’re affected, and so wouldn’t be caught off-guard the way shown in panel 5. (Even if you weren’t paying attention, I’d interpret the “cannot lie” rule as meaning “if you try to tell a lie, you instead find yourself unable to speak”, not “if you try to tell a lie, you instead accidentally blurt out the truth”.) So there may be some slight houserules in effect.
Personally I’d say that if you’re unsure about something, then pretending to be sure about it is a lie. So you can talk about things you merely suspect to be true, but you have to acknowledge that they’re merely suspicions.
Saying something that’s technically true but misleading is totally OK, though!
The rules don’t specify what happens to untrue things said without intent to deceive, such as jokes.
I hadn’t heard of Cunningham’s Law before, but according to Google, it says that “the best way to get the right answer on the internet is not to ask a question; it’s to post the wrong answer.” As for what it has to do with the comic, panel 4 is a demonstration. Dorilys says “there was no reason to invade our castle,” and Soft Tail immediately corrects her.
As for Zone of Truth, it prevents you from telling an intentional lie, but it doesn’t prevent you from being mistaken. The subject doesn’t gain knowledge they didn’t already have.
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Now, how long does it take them to learn that there are 2 other derro, some fungus imposters, and 1 Viscount still at large in the castle?
And which ones get a tower dropped on them, and which tower will it be, and how long will it take?
(I suppose it’s still possible that she won’t drop a tower on someone, but — it’s improbable.)
The law of Tchekhov’s Tower dictates it!
She may even drop one, and then, later, after we think it’s been fulfilled, drop another!
So you’re saying we may wind up waiting for the other tower to drop?
I didn’t realize in the previous page:
Behind the interrogation’s room’s door, looking through the window, is Cube. Wearing his helmet.
Yeah, he’s “doesn’t-fit-in-the-interrogation-room cop” from the alt text.
Oh my god there’s alt-text??
Only since about the middle of Level 1. Go back to the beginning and re-read every page to see all the alt-text. 🙂
The mouseover text is just as good as the rest of the dialogue and clears upa lot of questions 🙂
I love panel 3. Even with Derek on-hand to veto any of the stuff she really wants to do, Dorilys can still make the prisoners THINK that “zotting” is gonna hurt. Job satisfaction where you can find it…
Actually, Derek on-hand helps her be threatening. It allows her to ramp things up with the suggestion that if Derek ever fails to restrain her, things will get really dreadful.
Now I’m thinking of that story about an official world that got destroyed (flooded) because a player intentionally got a whole bunch of decanters of endless water and threw them into the ocean.
A future campaign in that world will center on the search for a mad artificer who made items only the completely insane would use. One such item: A Recanter of Endless Water.
For joke magic items, that one would be pretty serious.
Just popping in to appreciate the green dots in the last three panels showing where the ZOT in effect. Nice detail.
Come to think of it, it’s a zone of truth, and it doesn’t look like it was aimed accurately enough to prevent the interrogators from being included in the area of effect…
Yeah, I got a feeling we’re going to be hearing some pretty candid confessions on the next few pages.
Unfortunately Zone of Truth does not compel creatures to answer the questions. Shutting up makes the spell utter useless, at least according to player’s manual.
Fortunately, I think some derro aren’t very good at the “shutting up” part. And judging by the smirk, I think Dori knows that.
Yeah, that’s why she made that remark about self-control.
Derek: Of all the ideas you’ve ever had, Dorilys, zotting these derro is your best.
Dorilys: Ah, you’re just saying that.
Derek: I’m in the Zone of Truth. Couldn’t lie if I wanted to. This is literally the best idea you’ve ever had.
If he says that, I will start to wonder if they are brother and sister.
Presti: “It has a Will save, and you’re a Cleric. If anyone could lie in here right now, it’s you.”
So how is this supposed to work with Cunningham’s law?
Also, how exactly does a zone of truth work? Is it actually about truth or just what people think the truth is? Can you speculate? Also, can you speculate as long as you need and once you can say a thing, that thing must be true? Or is it a compulsion to tell the truth (provided you talk at all)? How much can you say that doesn’t have an associated truth value (questions, wishes, etc.)? How much can you say at all (about a specific subject) if you don’t actually know the truth/think you know the truth but don’t/don’t think you know the truth/think you don’t know the truth?
And since Cunningham’s law is involved: I assume a Zot will impart a subconscious knowledge of universal truth and you can ask anyone anything and they will be able to truthfully and substantially answer about literally everything. To keep people guessing, the knowledge of the truth will be eradicated from the mortal world within a day including all records, biological or otherwise.
In Hitchhiker’s Guide, I remember there was an incident where somebody started actually telling the whole truth, and the government reacted as if truth were a highly contagious, deadly disease.
Been a while since I read it, but as I recall, the government did the right thing. The guy who was OD’d on truth serum wound up reciting secrets of the universe so deep and fundamental that any sapient being that heard them would become incurably insane.
Naturally, one of the protagonists wound up seeking the guy out. I don’t remember for certain, but I’m guessing it was Zaphod.
According to canon rules (both 3.5e and 5e), a zone of truth means you can’t deliberately lie. You can still claim something that turns out to be incorrect, so long as you honestly believed it to be true.
Canon rules also, though, state that affected creatures know they’re affected, and so wouldn’t be caught off-guard the way shown in panel 5. (Even if you weren’t paying attention, I’d interpret the “cannot lie” rule as meaning “if you try to tell a lie, you instead find yourself unable to speak”, not “if you try to tell a lie, you instead accidentally blurt out the truth”.) So there may be some slight houserules in effect.
Personally I’d say that if you’re unsure about something, then pretending to be sure about it is a lie. So you can talk about things you merely suspect to be true, but you have to acknowledge that they’re merely suspicions.
Saying something that’s technically true but misleading is totally OK, though!
The rules don’t specify what happens to untrue things said without intent to deceive, such as jokes.
This comic has the house rule of Rule of Funny. And indeed, does not have an edition to assist in that
I hadn’t heard of Cunningham’s Law before, but according to Google, it says that “the best way to get the right answer on the internet is not to ask a question; it’s to post the wrong answer.” As for what it has to do with the comic, panel 4 is a demonstration. Dorilys says “there was no reason to invade our castle,” and Soft Tail immediately corrects her.
As for Zone of Truth, it prevents you from telling an intentional lie, but it doesn’t prevent you from being mistaken. The subject doesn’t gain knowledge they didn’t already have.
A Derro failing a will save? Well, now we know it’s definitely not 3.5 rules.
Help! Will somebody please explain to my why Dorilys is so keen to collapse towers!? I have the feeling that I’m missing out here.
Love that “let’s get down to business, shall we” look on Dorylis’ face in the last panel, priceless 🙂